Michael Simon, staff writer for PCWorld, discusses the Waymo vs. Uber trade secrets trial and the testimony from former Uber CEO Travis Kalanick.

We dig into Kalanick's statements in the trial where he seemed to distance himself from Anthony Levandowski, the former Waymo employee accused of taking trade secrets with him to Uber. Kalanick says he tried to give Levandowski independence while he ran Otto, the self-driving car company that Uber eventually acquired.

Simon says Kalanick's testimony could seem nefarious if you believe he was involved with the theft of intellectual property. He says the question here is where Levandowski ends and where Waymo begins.